Communications Breakdown: What Works (and Doesn't) in Health and Science Communication
Communications Breakdown is a new podcast that breaks down what works (and doesn't) in health and science communication. Hosted by Tracy Mehan and Katrina Boylan, this podcast brings you into their world of research translation, health promotion, public health communications strategy, website and social media management, graphic design, and much more.
Communications Breakdown: What Works (and Doesn't) in Health and Science Communication
Lessons from the Next Generation Part 2: Language, Storytelling, and Design Skills that Matter
What happens when academic language meets real-world health communication needs? In this episode—the second in a three-part series—we continue to explore some of the gaps between academic training and practical application in health communication.
At the end of Part 1, our conversation turned toward accessibility, and Part 2 picks up there, expanding into language and word choice and how to translate data into compelling stories that resonate with audiences. We close this session by discussing skills like evaluating resources for credibility and using programs like Canva for health communication.
Check out for Part 3 where we continue our conversation about graphic design, creativity, and planning for effective dissemination of health information.
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This podcast is a project of the Center for Injury Research Translation and Communication (CIRTC). Connect with CIRTC: www.cirtc.org
Find CIRTC on LinkedIn, Bluesky, and YouTube.
Note: all thoughts and opinions shared in this podcast are personal and not representative of any organization.
Hi everyone, this is Communications Breakdown. I'm Katrina Boylan, and because this is the second part of a three-part series, I'm going to keep this short. If you didn't listen to part one of this series on the state of health communication, I recommend that you stop and go do that. We introduce the students that you'll be hearing and give a little more background. That might be helpful.
Katrina:These three episodes are part of a larger conversation that Tracy and I had after listening to some of our recent interns talk about health communication and the skills they're looking for to be successful in the workplace. In the first episode, we hear about the state of health communication education, and then talk a lot about accessibility. And then, in the third part, we get into creativity, graphic design and what it looks like when we plan for dissemination. Coming up, though, we are going to get into language and word choice, how to use data for communications, and then end with some discussion on the design tool, canva. So let's pick up where we stopped in part one.
Katrina:Okay, so then let's move to kind of the second half of this question. That was one part of it, but we did hear another theme emerge during this particular question, so let's hear some thoughts on language.
Elena:Yeah, I think in the future, in whatever job I end up with, I think that language is super important, like the levels of language that you use to portray whatever. Like whatever project you're working on, sometimes you need to use a higher level of language. Sometimes you need to use lower level of language. Coming from an academic space, I've always just assumed that the higher level the language you can use, the better. But that's not always true, and so for some of the instagram carousels that I've done, we've really had to work on some of the language, because when you, you know, pull it out of studies or off of documents, it's often a lot more high level than what most people are able to comprehend.
Tracy:Elena's comments about language levels and health literacy really resonated with me and some of the experiences I had as a PhD student.
Tracy:When she said, coming from an academic space, I've always thought the higher level language you use, the better, but that's not always the case. I literally gasped and it made me think of, you know, when I first started my PhD in public health, I was in my mid forties, so I had been out of academia and working in the health communication field for quite a while at that point. And when I first started submitting work for school, I was told over and over again that my writing was very clear and concise but it was not academic enough. Yeah, and you know me. So, because of who I am and the fact that I was in my 40s, I consistently fought back against that and said no. By making our academic work too high level, we're actually making it inaccessible to the very people we need to read it and understand it.
Katrina:Yeah.
Tracy:Now, I do understand that we have to be aware of who our audience is. That's one of the things we teach, right. So we have to speak in ways that will make them most likely to hear our message. So I had to learn that I did need to start writing up because when I'm in the academic space, I needed to do that. That's your audience, that's my audience. But I think it's really important for people in academia to hear that we also need to teach our students how to write and create effectively for non-academic audiences. Absolutely, they need both of those skill sets and I think that the focus too often is only on that academic style of communication. For sure, when I was taking classes, we did get assignments to create campaigns or write a social media post, but what we didn't get was the training that should go alongside of that. That said, here's the research from the field of health communications that says this is how you should construct the messaging for that campaign to make sure it resonates with the audience you're trying to reach. Right, right.
Tracy:So if I were designing public health programs, I would build health communication, best practices and education in as required elements for every degree path. I said it before. I had to go outside of the College of Public Health in my program to find health literacy and I had to go to the communications department to learn about some of the communication skills and the communications department was great, but they were teaching the PR marketing side of communications, not that communication that we were talking about. That's the public health behavior change communication. Right, I have one more controversial thing I'm going to say here and then I'll stop so you can respond. Okay, this may be one of my more controversial hot takes, but I personally believe that some of the time, the reasons our health communications campaigns fail is not because they weren't important or that the concepts behind the messages weren't right, but because they were designed by people who had not learned these health communications best practices that we're talking about. Health communications is a robust field in its own right.
Katrina:Absolutely.
Tracy:And many public health programs aren't acknowledging that or telling people to go outside of the program and they're just not getting the training and the students aren't learning how to do this.
Katrina:Right, what's the point of having the best designed program in the world if nobody even hears about it or can't engage with it, can't actually participate? Am I, you know? Is this something that I can even engage with? It's that system one versus system two thinking. You know the idea that most of the time we're processing on this kind of really low information, quick, automatic level, and so when we put data at the beginning, we have to almost you have to shift to system two in most cases, and so I think we just overestimate the number of time, you know the amount of time, people spend in that system two. They're really able to engage with the data.
Tracy:So yeah, I think we need to take a more active role in translating the research for them. I agree. So many scientists and researchers that we work with say, well, we just need to tell them the data, they'll get it if they know the facts, when that's not actually true. And it's a skill to learn how to do that and how to think about it, and I don't think it's one that we're doing a great job of teaching in public health. We need to learn how to craft these stories that help people understand why our research matters to them. What does my audience need, right, and what can I do that will make a difference in my own life based on this research?
Katrina:Yeah, and I I think that there is, you talked about COVID earlier, and I think there's a lot of examples in these young people's lives where they've seen this actually matter, and so I do think that that's giving it also some you know salience that maybe you know some of the rest of us haven't experienced. But I'll just say one other thing on this, and that is that, as somebody who was not trained in public health, who has learned on the job, it's a struggle for me to sit in, you know, a seminar where it's datea, methods, basically your paper but on a slide. If you can't give me more than something I can read in the paper, why it matters to different audiences, you know how it's going to apply to things, you know the, so what then? There's nothing in it for me, and so, having sat in a number of presentations where that's really what it is. Now again, in many of those cases it's appropriate, because that is what it's about. It may be, you know, a postdoc interview or something like that where it's entirely appropriate to use that.
Katrina:And you know that reminds me of a time when I attended a seminar with a colleague who is, you know, traditionally trained. She's a scientist, right? You know she's a data cruncher and loves the data, and so we went to a seminar and it was on, I think it was on concussion prevention and the guy, if I recall correctly, was looking at this is going to sound odd, I think, but the way woodpeckers' tongues created extra pressure in the cranium when they would peck at wood so that they avoided the concussive effects of that motion right, because you know, that's similar to what we're experiencing as humans when we experience concussions. And so he was trying to mimic some of that technology, or some of that not technology, because it's woodpeckers, right, but some of nature's, I guess, remedies to some of these issues. He was trying to figure out could we harness that same effect? And so he had a product that he was testing out, and so he told this in my opinion, wonderful story about the woodpecker and how it came to be and all of this and the team he was testing with and all of this. And I walked out of there and I was like, man, that was a great presentation. And the colleague that I was with was like what are you talking about? That was a terrible presentation. Where was his data? Where were his methods? Where was you know? She needed much more rigorous scientific analysis for her to buy into his premise and buy into his message there, and so it was a great learning experience for all of us on this team.
Katrina:I think of really understanding that you are probably going to have more than one type of person in your audience, and so how can you design something that at least tries to message to all of them or deliver what they need to hear? So I think about that a lot in our work, that in many cases we are talking to other scientists, and so there are times when jargon might be appropriate even, and so trying to again get really individual with what does this audience need, or what does the secondary audience need, what do different people in this audience need? I have seen some really, really great seminars in our larger institution where they do the science. You know the science is all there, but it's also there's then this why this matters.
Katrina:You know what can we see beyond what I've published or what's in the data? You know what's the larger vision of this and that sense of so what. You know why this matters outside of this room, or even to maybe somebody in this room who isn't in my field. You know, we work in a large institution where just because you're my colleague doesn't mean our science is the same and that we understand the nuances of each other's fields either. So, yeah, I love the fact that these students are picking up on these themes, because I do think they translate even out into the real world. You know what we're seeing in our institution.
Tracy:Yeah, for sure, it's a really important set of skills that I would love to see more people learn how to do.
Katrina:All right, well, so fortunately, our interns did learn how to do this, and so we did hear a little bit and a question I asked them what skills have you learned that you've already put into use? Again, we're going to go back to that theme here, and so let's hear what they had to say about what has been immediately useful to them.
Elena:You have really taught me how to kind of create a story with whether it's statistics or creating an instagram carousel. You've really taught me how to tell a story, and so I think that picking out the information that helps you tell the story, no matter what topic it's on, I think that that is just super helpful.
Yara:Um, definitely my Canva experience. I had already been a canva user before my internship, but both you and katie have taught me so much about the platform. It was like literally starting from scratch, helped me with like shortcuts and also looking at it from the accessibility side. They've all become part of my normal Canva usage. And also I was taught how to do environmental scans and I've recently put that into practice for my research assisting position this semester.
Tracy:I love this question because it tells us what they're really learning and what they find value in. Yeah, and I heard Elena talk about learning how to pick out which information to use that will help you tell a story, no matter what form your communication is taking. She even talked about you know whether it's a story of an Instagram carousel, and we know that many families are actually getting information from social media like TikTok and Instagram and, as a field, public health is not doing a great job of teaching our public health students how to really communicate and tell stories through platforms like those, and it's a really different skill set and it is one you have to really have done yourself to be able to teach well, and, in my experience, not many professors have enough experience themselves in this area to teach and give feedback on that.
Katrina:It is probably a new enough concept that a lot of people that are teaching right now might not have had that opportunity to learn that that wasn't a part of what their educational experience, or, you know, their previous experience, has been. But I think the thing for Elena is that you know she's a communications student, you know, and you had mentioned earlier, that communications is not taught this angle. They're taught more about marketing and PR generally, and I believe Alina had kind of suggested that at her school as well, and so I thought this was a great example of why communications, the school of communications, isn't the right fit for a lot of these skills either, because it's really an interplay of all of these things. It's not kind of the pure marketing PR stuff, but there are elements of it, but there are elements of the public health side as well, and so that's where HealthCom really does exist, is one foot in more of that marketing PR kind of angle, but also everything's got to be evidence-based. So I really enjoyed the fact that Elena highlighted this as something she's already been able to put to use.
Tracy:Yeah, and, to be fair, I think we need to be learning more from the field of communication about those PR and marketing skills, and we'll talk again about that, but it's important to have both right.
Katrina:For sure, right, but that's why I loved having Elena. We can teach you the public health side. In fact, that was me. I got taught the public health side of things. I knew the communication side. I did not know public health and so I can really relate to you know Elena's experience there.
Katrina:But I do want to touch on the other thing that we heard, which was I thought it was fascinating to hear Yara say that she hadn't really done environmental scans or the concept of kind of a deep research and that is something that I am seeing, and I've seen in other interns as well is that when we ask for environmental scans for a certain topic, we expect you know a lot of resources to be coming up on these, and so what I have found is that they'll often give me something that's you know a handful of resources, you know maybe a couple of videos, a couple of fact sheets, things like that, and I'm like, no, we need to see everything.
Katrina:And the idea that I think there's something to be learned from taking that really 30,000 foot view and the super close up. You know you've got to get to zoom way out and see everything you're working with before you can zoom back in, and so I loved the fact that Yara has been able to implement that particular skill. How do you get both sides? I don't hear people mention that that often as a skill they've implemented, but it is something I've noticed over the years. That is not always, I think, the most, I don't know intuitive for some of our students.
Tracy:Yeah, I think you do a really nice job of teaching them to not only get an overview of what resources are available, but thinking about the quality of those resources and even the impact that those resources will have on people, which I think is even more important these days. And, honestly, it made me think of a story from a former intern where we had her go out and she found this fantastic article about marijuana edibles and we wanted to do that research because we're seeing a rise in injuries to young kids getting into marijuana edibles now that these products are more legal. Right, she found this great resource. The article was really well written, had great tips that would be easy to put into practice. It did all the things we were asking her to do. But what she didn't think about was the fact that the article was on a website called Toke of the Town. That was all about marijuana products, right and so not the voice we're going for.
Tracy:Right, and I had to have a conversation with her about you know this is great and it's a great resource conversation with her about you know this is great and it's a great resource. But when we link to a source like that, there is this implication that you're supporting the information from that site and that the resources on that platform are something that you would recommend. Yeah, and as a children's hospital, I can't send it or you to a place that promotes marijuana use right, and I'm guessing many organizations are not going to be a fan of that. So it really got her thinking. Even though that was a great resource, it's not one that I can link to. So what else do I need to look at? And this comes up all the time. Just this week, I had to teach some medical students the same set of skills. These are great resources. I can't link to them, and here's why I can't. Let's walk through that.
Katrina:Right, and it is. It's something that we talk about virtually every single round evaluating a resource for, again, not only the correctness of the information, but we also we will look at how is it displayed? Is it engaging? You know, there's a bunch of stuff we look at and then, ultimately, is this something that we want to share, but another one I'll just shout out for for anybody listening, is one we see a lot is in injury prevention.
Katrina:A lot of law firms will create really great visuals and the material's all correct, and I'll see this a lot. And so when we do environmental scans, we'll say, oh, I found this great resource, and then it will have been produced by a law firm, and so we have to talk about how that's going to be inherently a conflict of interest for us, and so we just we can't use that, even if it's really great material. And so then it might be discussing OK, well, if we like how this is displayed, how can we fill a gap? You know, if we can't use this one and we can't just, you know, steal their stuff, right, so maybe, how is it we can, you know, design something that you know, kind of again, fill that gap?
Tracy:Another thing that came up in these comments that I wanted to highlight was Canva, and Canva is an amazing tool and it really has transformed what health communicators and public health professionals can do, and I love that you don't have to be a trained graphic designer now to create the materials on this platform, but there are principles of graphic design and health communication that really do make a difference on how messages are received.
Tracy:Things like white space, font size, color combinations, even the way you chunk information to put them on the graphic All of that can have an impact on design and message reception, and so our students are now we're hearing using platforms like Canva in school, which I think is great, yeah, but they're not necessarily getting feedback on those skills. So when she said it was like literally starting from scratch when you and Katie taught her a lot about how to use it, that really resonated with me. I think there might be a place for let's learn some Canva design skills with graphic designers, because we know public health departments and people that are they're going to have to know some of those skills. Not every department, not every place you're going to work, is going to have a graphic designer on staff, so let's teach some of those skills as well. Yeah.
Katrina:And you know, there is one other thing on this Canva thing that I want to touch on, and that is that most students if not all of them they might have some Canva experience coming in, but there is an accessibility checker right there in Canva that is super easy to find and virtually none of them has ever used it or seen it or anything. And so, going back to the comments about accessibility, the way it shows up in Canva is easy to remedy these days and again we've actually got a share my screen series on that too, and so one of the things I have the interns do is watch some of those old share my screens and things like that to help learn these skills. But Canva does make it super easy to check the accessibility of your documents, and so I love the fact that Yara has been able to learn again not only those principles of graphic design but how to integrate other things that she has found important in health communication.
Tracy:Yeah, that's a great point. I think a lot of professionals don't even realize that's there.
Katrina:Yeah yeah, so All right, folks. That's it for this second part of our conversation on all things health com as seen through the eyes of students and future young professionals. The third part of this set continues on the thread of graphic design and creativity, so definitely check that out. As always, thanks for listening and please do like share, subscribe and comment. You know you know the drill, so we'll see you then for part three. Thanks everyone.
